4:16 On the Head of a Pin
Discussing Supernatural Season 4, Episode 16 "On the Head of a Pin." Liz rants about how hard it is to research angels. Diana gets hungry for Enochian Gnocchi. And finally Uriel the dick is dead. Don't come back.
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Transcript
On this week's episode of Double Strap podcast, we're going to talk about how we want Cass to boop us so hard.
Speaker B:Just boop that forehead, Cass, and send me an angel.
Speaker B:Just not your eel.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Enjoy that, rick.
Speaker A:Roll.
Speaker B:Let's do this.
Speaker A:Are we doing this?
Speaker A:Ye.
Speaker B:Sam to Devil's trap podcast, season four for episode 16, on the Head of a Pin.
Speaker B:I am Diana.
Speaker A:I'm Liz.
Speaker B:I didn't do a weird intro that time.
Speaker B:What are you looking at me like?
Speaker A:You're just perky, man.
Speaker A:And like, I know you're not feeling that perky right now.
Speaker A:So, like, you're just like, fuck it.
Speaker A:I'm so blah that I'm going to be perky to, like, I can't do that.
Speaker A:I think I have to save up that.
Speaker A:That side.
Speaker A:That frontage.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:For the next week.
Speaker B:Just.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, what have you been up to?
Speaker B:We just got out of.
Speaker B:You know, we had a holiday weekend this past weekend, and so short work weeks kind of.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker A:Yeah, I. I don't.
Speaker A:It was like.
Speaker A:I have no idea what I did this weekend.
Speaker A:I know I got plants and I put them in the ground and one of them's already flowering.
Speaker A:It's very ambitious.
Speaker A:I'm very proud of it.
Speaker A:I got some.
Speaker A:I got some cute succulents and went to this really cool, like, organic dirt.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:Nursery place in Austin that has a goat.
Speaker A:There's supposedly.
Speaker B:There's two goats.
Speaker A:I got this one goat and they have, like, chickens that have really great legs.
Speaker A:They're like.
Speaker A:Have lots of feathers on them.
Speaker A:They're pretty good.
Speaker A:And that was my big outing for the weekend.
Speaker A:I think I plan to do other things, but I worked a lot.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And then also, like, lay on my couch and watch British game shows.
Speaker B:Mm.
Speaker B:That's about you.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I feel like.
Speaker B:I feel like I didn't do much.
Speaker B:I mean, it was.
Speaker B:I had a lot of things go on.
Speaker B:I don't, you know, I don't really share it with you guys, but it's been kind of like, when it rains, it pours kind of a scenario.
Speaker B:It's like, oh, can something go wrong here?
Speaker B:Yes, I will.
Speaker B:For the last couple, like, I literally say, like, the last month, it's been probably like that.
Speaker B:It feels like it at least.
Speaker B:So it's just.
Speaker B:And everything's fine.
Speaker B:Everybody's fine.
Speaker B:Except for the fact that it's beating my soul down.
Speaker B:And I want to go crawl into my bed and tell the world to fuck off because I am mentally exhausted from it.
Speaker A:You can also do that.
Speaker A:I give you permission to crawl into your bed.
Speaker B:But then.
Speaker B:But then I feel bad about myself for doing nothing.
Speaker B:And so it spirals because I am not.
Speaker B:I know.
Speaker A:And then you go into the guilt shame.
Speaker A:Yes, I am very well.
Speaker A:I am a queen of the that that's that cycle.
Speaker A:But however you are still and like.
Speaker A:And sometimes you just have to sit and I do this all the time.
Speaker A:Like where it was like, if like you can take 10 minutes to sit in this bath, like that is fine.
Speaker A:You are allowed to do this.
Speaker A:And then I'm like, has your life become so ridiculous that you have to yell at yourself that it's okay for you to sit here for like 10 minutes and take a goddamn.
Speaker B:Well, I did that for myself yesterday.
Speaker B:I did at the end of the end of my weekend, basically with a few.
Speaker B:About hour in the pool with a book.
Speaker B:It was pretty lovely.
Speaker B:So that part was lovely.
Speaker B:And a pina colada or three.
Speaker B:So I mean that was a nice way to finish off, you know, sometime.
Speaker B:But yeah, so that was.
Speaker B:I've allowed some of that as well.
Speaker B:It's just been, you know.
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker B:And then I cleaned up shit vomit after that because it's just like it sounds in case you're wondering.
Speaker B:Because I have dogs that are stupid.
Speaker B:So you know, it's like, oh, finally relax.
Speaker A:This is so great.
Speaker A:Oh, gross.
Speaker B:But yeah, you know, what can you do there?
Speaker B:It's life.
Speaker A:We're ending that conversation.
Speaker B:You're welcome for that.
Speaker A:For that.
Speaker A:Nope, nope.
Speaker A:Diana's done.
Speaker A:Okay, so this episode.
Speaker A:What are you drinking?
Speaker B:I am.
Speaker B:Because of the number of beverages I had over this weekend.
Speaker B:I decided that and I'm already sleepy.
Speaker B:I decided another cherry Coke.
Speaker B:The cherry vanilla Coke Zero sounded appropriate for this evening.
Speaker B:So I'm being a little.
Speaker B:Little lame here.
Speaker B:But drinking my delicious soda.
Speaker A:Yeah, I am drinking wine because I keep like seeing people drink wine on TV and I'm like that looks delightful, but I really can't do that right now.
Speaker A:And then I'm like that that's not.
Speaker A:So I am just saying fuck it.
Speaker A:And I'm drinking one of the graveyard vineyards and is their.
Speaker A:Their Petite Verdot.
Speaker A:So one of our local wineries.
Speaker A:Although the.
Speaker A:The wine itself come to California.
Speaker A:Their tasting room is here.
Speaker A:So whatever.
Speaker A:It's fucking local.
Speaker A:We'll take it.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:Anything else?
Speaker A:Noo.
Speaker A:Seems kind of slow or I just haven't looked both at.
Speaker A:Both are possible.
Speaker B:We're gonna go.
Speaker B:Not looked.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Let's jump into this episode though.
Speaker B:I think we've got some.
Speaker B:It's a fairly emotional episode to unpack, I would say.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So the title was on the Head of a Pen.
Speaker A:This was season four, episode 16th.
Speaker A: ,: Speaker A:This was directed by Grohl, who we had before Usual Suspects, Folsom Prison, Bedtime Stories.
Speaker A:Also the director of the Princess, which is Lest We Forgot.
Speaker A:I will say that every time, because I think that is the most impressive credit to anybody written by Ben Edlund.
Speaker A:And, yeah, we're going to start off with car alarms annoyingly off.
Speaker A:Like, this was happening.
Speaker A:I was like, having.
Speaker A:I was having a date, and I was just like, fuck you turn off these goddamn car alarms.
Speaker B:Well, you realize it's a massive car wreck, so it's not like just the alarms going off.
Speaker B:But I can relate a little bit to your annoyance because Castiel walks up and he, like, does his angel magic, and all the alarms shut off.
Speaker B:And I'm like, that.
Speaker B:That's the trick I want.
Speaker B:That is my magic.
Speaker B:That is my super.
Speaker B:That is what I need.
Speaker A:Diana.
Speaker A:So we found Diana's superpower, and it is to turn off car alarms, apparently.
Speaker B:Well, there's, like, near my office, there's an apartment complex, and somebody's.
Speaker B:I feel like at least every other day, someone's alarm goes off unnecessarily for a long time.
Speaker B:But yeah.
Speaker B:So anyways.
Speaker B:And I mean, it would be a pretty good one.
Speaker A:I mean, and.
Speaker A:Or, like, can you imagine, like, to turn off, like, you could even do it.
Speaker A:So you could turn off alarm clocks in someone else's room.
Speaker A:Like, if you're in, like, an apartment, apartment or hotel, somebody has that alarm that's just going off.
Speaker A:And then you're wondering if they're dead, and that's why they're not turning off their alarm.
Speaker A:And then you sit there, like, were they murdered?
Speaker A:Do I need to call the cops?
Speaker B:And then you're just mad because you're awake and they're not.
Speaker A:But yeah.
Speaker A:Or they, like, really just, like, that asshole left his house and, like, didn't.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker A:Or the worst is even worse than that.
Speaker A:Just like, hotel alarm clocks.
Speaker A:When I was in L. A.
Speaker A:A couple of weeks ago, somebody left the hotel, like, alarm clock in the.
Speaker A:By the bed, and it went off.
Speaker B:At 6:00am oh, that's rude.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:If I could haunt somebody, I would track that person down and haunt them.
Speaker B:At 6am every day for the rest of their life.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker B:So we've got Castiel walking through this wreckage from, like, this massive car pile up and.
Speaker A:Wait, what did you say?
Speaker A:What did you call him?
Speaker A:Did you call him Castiel?
Speaker B:Castiel.
Speaker A:Castiel.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:You got very, very.
Speaker A:Got very New England Castiel.
Speaker B:Is Castiel walking through this wreckage and you see a blonde woman on the ground, dressed in white.
Speaker B:And she is very, very clean compared to her surroundings, being a big car wreck mess.
Speaker B:And she has a big, like a bloody wound on her chest.
Speaker B:Looks kind of like a puncture wound of some kind that's bleeding.
Speaker B:And he says it rises and the cops pull up and as they.
Speaker A:Is that about his penis?
Speaker A:No, no, that's fine.
Speaker B:He's very not specific.
Speaker B:Very un.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:We don't know what's rising.
Speaker B:So something's rising.
Speaker B:But as they're zooming away, you notice that this blonde woman, this deceased blonde woman, is laying in the same exact position as mom and Sam's ex and all that.
Speaker B:So it's like this.
Speaker B:That carry on of that curse, I guess.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Only she's not on the.
Speaker B:On the ceiling.
Speaker A:Okay, that's what you saw.
Speaker B:That's what I saw.
Speaker A:You didn't see the big giant wings on the ground?
Speaker B:No, I missed them.
Speaker B:I guess I had a big.
Speaker B:I guess I had a. I guess I had a glare.
Speaker B:That's what I noticed.
Speaker B:I was so focused on how she was laying and taking notes and looking at the.
Speaker B:And looking at the cops rolling up.
Speaker B:Missed it.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay, so she pants back.
Speaker A:And this is something that will come into purpose later in this episode and spoiler maybe in the future.
Speaker A:So as they pan up from her, we notice her body position, but also she has two very large black wings that are like the size of like, oversized black wings that are all like, basically ashed into the.
Speaker A:Scorched into the ground.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So that and Castiel saying, goodbye, sister.
Speaker A:We know.
Speaker A:Oh, bitch is an angel.
Speaker B:All right, cool.
Speaker B:So we cut to Sam and Dean driving.
Speaker B:Sam's driving.
Speaker B:Driving baby down a country road, and they are going to meet Ruby and Cheyenne for leads on Lilith.
Speaker A:And Sam's really trying to, like, pump Dean up for this.
Speaker A:He's like, yeah, we're going to meet Ruby and it's fine because blah, blah, blah.
Speaker A:And like, Dean is like.
Speaker A:It's like when that person gets invited to your vacation that you don't want to go, and you're just like, yeah, man, it's fine.
Speaker A:It's cool.
Speaker A:Dean, like, just like, whatever.
Speaker A:Like, I'm just really pissed off because Pamela is dead and you should be, too.
Speaker A:Fuck you guys.
Speaker A:Avenge Pamela.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And things like, look, I'm just really tired.
Speaker B:He's tired of bearing friends and he's just tired in general.
Speaker B:And Sam tells him that I need you to get angry, so.
Speaker A:No, I want to be tired.
Speaker A:And I think he is angry.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, I can be angry and tired.
Speaker A:I am right now, in fact.
Speaker A:All right, so they go to a.
Speaker B:Motel and guess who's waiting for them in their room but Castiel.
Speaker B:And Uriel, of course.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And Dean's just like, oh, come on.
Speaker A:And I was like, man, I feel you.
Speaker A:And I imagine Diana with the week you had, like, also the kind of like, we just like, fuck.
Speaker A:And it was just like, oh, is going to be my meme probably for the rest of this week.
Speaker A:And I encourage all of you to take this as your.
Speaker A:As your gift, as your meme for this week.
Speaker A:Come on.
Speaker B:Come on.
Speaker B:So Sam's like, look, we just got back from Pamela's funeral.
Speaker B:Remember her motherfuckers.
Speaker B:Anyways, and he.
Speaker B:Dean goes off about it and he's like, you know, the woman whose eyes you burned out, blah, blah.
Speaker B:And Neuro's like, no, you should be grateful to us.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But Castiel actually tries to empathize.
Speaker B:And it's like, look, I know, I know we're asking a lot and it sucks.
Speaker B:But Uriel's like, no, no, we don't feel bad.
Speaker B:Fuck you.
Speaker B:Seven angels are dead.
Speaker B:Dean's like, and you need.
Speaker B:They think a demon did it.
Speaker B:And Dean's like, you need our help hunting a demon?
Speaker B:The fuck?
Speaker B:So they're like, no, we.
Speaker B:We have Alistair because last episode they got him and.
Speaker B:But he won't talk to us.
Speaker B:So we want Dean to torture.
Speaker B:Interrogate him.
Speaker B:Because Dean taught or trained under him in torture.
Speaker B:So this is real fucking dark.
Speaker B:So, yeah, that liked you up mentally.
Speaker B:That is like your own personal hell on top of being an actual hell.
Speaker B:We need you to do that again, but for God forgot.
Speaker A:That's cool, right?
Speaker A:Like, I mean, I know like you said you had some PTSD about this.
Speaker A:There were some trauma or whatever and you know, you don't feel.
Speaker A:Oh, but you know, I mean, God wants you to do it.
Speaker B:And like, oh, on top of that, like, you know, we.
Speaker B:Even if you say no, we're gonna make you do it.
Speaker B:So it's fine.
Speaker B:It's fine.
Speaker A:Yeah, you don't.
Speaker A:You don't have free will.
Speaker A:That's just.
Speaker A:That's just not a thing.
Speaker A:And so we're gonna zap you away.
Speaker A:Yeah, so they zap them away and they're Gone.
Speaker A:And Sam's all alone.
Speaker B:Sam's lone.
Speaker A:Damn.
Speaker B:It's pretty funny.
Speaker B:So they're in like this creepy ass warehouse thing where they have Alistair chained to a Devil's trap, basically surrounded by a devil's trap.
Speaker A:Yeah, it basically is like a.
Speaker A:You know, it's a six pointed star, like a Star of David or anything.
Speaker A:And it's surrounded by old Enochian symbols.
Speaker A:Nokian, whatever.
Speaker A:And you know, this is like my nose.
Speaker A:You can tell what year it was.
Speaker B:Made me think of Noki.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:Although I ate Domino's yesterday.
Speaker A:And I feel like I've had a brick stomach like just the entire day, which is like what I get for eating just like fake cheese and fake meat or whatever.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, I really processed.
Speaker B:Processed.
Speaker A:Process, process.
Speaker A:So my stomach is like, you so.
Speaker A:But yeah, so when I was like, my notes for this, I'm like, Dean tries to leave Uriel, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker A:Because I'm just so tired of Muriel.
Speaker B:But Dean's like, look, you're at.
Speaker B:This is too much.
Speaker B:You can't ask me to do this.
Speaker B:This is way too much.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And while Uriel gives no fucks and he's just an asshole because duh, he's Uriel.
Speaker B:Castiel's like, look, now I know this is a lot to ask, but we have to ask it.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And it's not a choice here.
Speaker B:And he's like.
Speaker B:Dean's like, I didn't talk to you by yourself.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:And so.
Speaker B:And there is one moderately humorous exchange here where Castiel tells Dean that Uriel is the funniest angel in the Garrison.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And well, you know, this is after Dean asked Uriel to get donuts.
Speaker A:And Uriel's like, think I'm sorry.
Speaker A:I like you.
Speaker A:And then I flap off.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:But yes, Uriel, ask anybody.
Speaker A:Uriel's the funniest angel in the Garrison.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So anyways, Gaziel tells Dean that, look, I'm.
Speaker B:I'm in trouble.
Speaker B:I've been showing emotion.
Speaker B:I have.
Speaker B:Obviously I have developed, you know, some fondness towards you.
Speaker B:And this, you know, doesn't.
Speaker B:This is bad for me as an angel in my job.
Speaker B:And Dean is like real sad and he's.
Speaker B:And Castiel says, look, this is necessary.
Speaker B:I. I would do anything to not have to have you do this, but I don't have a choice.
Speaker B:So Dean goes for it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And, you know, I do have it here.
Speaker A:You, Dean just like, you know, if I do this, you're not going to like what comes back.
Speaker A:And I really wish that Cass had said, I don't like you now.
Speaker B:But he didn't.
Speaker A:I was just.
Speaker B:You.
Speaker A:You had that opportunity.
Speaker A:But yeah.
Speaker A:So they're going to go off and Dean's going to get a rolling cart just followed towards.
Speaker A:And I'm like, fuck, yes.
Speaker A:Give me that.
Speaker A:That looks like fun.
Speaker A:It's like.
Speaker A:It's got all sorts of little potion things on it and little sticky stuff and things you could poke things with.
Speaker B:Pokey things and sharp things and, you.
Speaker A:Know, probably fiery things and sandpapery things.
Speaker B:So he goes.
Speaker B:He walks in and Alistair is singing, but then just starts laughing when he sees the cart and realizes what Dean is there to do.
Speaker B:So Dean says, why are you asking him the question?
Speaker B:He's there to ask, who is killing angels?
Speaker B:And Alistair just taunts him.
Speaker B:And this is basically like, half of my notes are like, Alastair taunts Dean, Alistair tauntine.
Speaker B:Which is pretty much.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's pretty.
Speaker A:And I say, I have the same.
Speaker A:It's really just this torturer dance, right?
Speaker A:And you kind of see this trope anytime.
Speaker A:Like, two bad.
Speaker A:One badass is torturing another badass.
Speaker A:And, like, the person being tortured is like, oh, this doesn't bother me, like.
Speaker A:But it does.
Speaker A:Did you go.
Speaker A:They go back and forth and so, like, there's a whole bunch of shit that goes on.
Speaker A:But we get to a really interesting point during this evil monologue that's going on when Alastair finally says, I bet you want payback for what I did to you and your daddy.
Speaker B:Dum dum, dum.
Speaker B:So we now know that Alistair Alastair also tortured John.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:But I don't know.
Speaker A:We can't find out.
Speaker A:We'll find out next because we're gonna.
Speaker B:Go to Salmon Ruby in the motel.
Speaker B:And she's like, all annoyed because she can smell the angels were there.
Speaker B:And she's like, she still doesn't want.
Speaker A:To be in the mix of that angel smell.
Speaker A:I don't want to be with angels.
Speaker A:I don't think there's anything wrong with torturing angels.
Speaker A:And you're right.
Speaker A:Like, there's that.
Speaker A:Or torturing demons or whoever.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:That was.
Speaker B:But yeah, so Sam's like, oh, no, but Dean can't do this.
Speaker B:He's not strong enough.
Speaker B:I need you to take me to him.
Speaker B:And so we cut back.
Speaker A:This is also real weird, too.
Speaker A:Like, this is like.
Speaker A:To me, that is like such an egotistical thing for Sam to say.
Speaker B:He really has.
Speaker B:Doesn't have a lot of faith in Dean these days.
Speaker B:It's very weird.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's just like, no, you can't do it.
Speaker A:It's me.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So we cut back and Alistair is still talking about John to Dean and that basically this is where this.
Speaker B:I think it, like already this.
Speaker B:It's dark that Dean's doing this.
Speaker B:Obviously.
Speaker B:Duh.
Speaker B:Because it's a big ask.
Speaker B:But this is where it starts taking a real fucking dark turn.
Speaker B:And I think this is kind of like.
Speaker B:Just sets the tone for us, the episode, which is really kind of sad.
Speaker B:That's what I think about it.
Speaker B:So Alistair tells Dean that he made John the same offer that Dean was made.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But Dean broke after 30 years.
Speaker B:John didn't break for 100.
Speaker A:He never broke.
Speaker B:Never broke?
Speaker A:Yeah, he never broke.
Speaker A:They.
Speaker A:They rescued him from hell before that, before he.
Speaker B:Before he had to.
Speaker B:Before he broke.
Speaker B:To Alastair's torture.
Speaker B:So then Dean came, but then Dean was in hell and.
Speaker B:And Alistair made him the offer for 30 years and.
Speaker B:And Dean broke.
Speaker B:So John was stuff of heroes, but Dean, not so much, basically.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:He also calls him Daddy's little girl, which is kind of gross.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And also just the way that.
Speaker A:I mean, Alastair and David.
Speaker A:What's his name, the guy who played him.
Speaker A:Sorry, it's very tired.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Is Chris Heyerdahl.
Speaker B:Christopher.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And he really has a lot of interesting things to say about this scene and just interacting with Jensen Ackles and this is fantastic acting that is happening.
Speaker A:What's going back and forth between them is.
Speaker B:It's very well done.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:It's very well done.
Speaker A:I think they play very well together.
Speaker A:It's over the top, but not too much at the same time.
Speaker A:It's like.
Speaker A:What?
Speaker B:It's dark?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like you said, it's dark.
Speaker B:So Dean tells Alastair, though, that he could still dream even when he was in hell, which I thought was interesting, but that also he dreamt of doing this, which was torturing him.
Speaker B:So he gets a syringe full of holy water and says, let's get started.
Speaker B:So do you think.
Speaker A:I mean, I guess probably you would not be the person answer this, but, I mean, in a way, would this bring him closure?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:To be able to turn the tables back on Alistair.
Speaker B:I think that he might try to rationalize that in some ways in his brain, but I don't think so.
Speaker B:I think it would actually make.
Speaker A:Not.
Speaker B:I think it would actually bring things back, exacerbate it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's like one of those Things like, sometimes you think like, someone's being petty.
Speaker B:Well, but you think.
Speaker B:Sometimes you think, like, getting revenge in some way is going to make you feel better.
Speaker B:And really it just opens the wound again.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And that's the theme of, like, a lot of.
Speaker A:A lot of myths and allegories and TVs and movies.
Speaker A:That revenge is not always what it's cracked up to be.
Speaker A:No, but at the same time, like, if somebody torture my ass in hell for a bunch of years, this also seems like a lot of fun.
Speaker A:All right, so he's got his.
Speaker A:His big syringe.
Speaker A:But we're gonna cut away from him to Cass alone in the room listening to this happen.
Speaker A:So we know he's aware of, like, what's going on.
Speaker A:And he's just standing there.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And we hear cut back.
Speaker B:And Alistair is like, sputtering, kind of like struggling, obviously, with the holy water injection, but tells Dean to go to hell and won't answer his questions.
Speaker A:So back to the motel.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So Ruby's gonna do, like, really cool spell.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's a cool spell.
Speaker A:Like, why can't Ruby be like this all the time?
Speaker A:Like, I don't know.
Speaker B:She's doing a badass spell and she's being all snarky but cool about it.
Speaker B:And she's got this map.
Speaker B:She says this incantation and it.
Speaker B:The whole map catches on fire.
Speaker B:And Sam's like, oh, shit, it's fucked up.
Speaker B:And she's like, no, motherfucker, watch this.
Speaker B:And the map, fire goes out except for the one spot where they are.
Speaker B:Which is supposed to tell them where Dean, Castiel and Uriel and Alistair are.
Speaker A:Which is awesome because I love the way this is done.
Speaker A:And I also think, like, her black eyes, like, look really good in the scene.
Speaker A:Like, they don't look like, as freaky as they normally would.
Speaker A:Like, they just kind of blend.
Speaker A:It's almost like dark willow and buffy.
Speaker A:Like, in a way just like.
Speaker A:Yeah, I like this dark magic thing that's happening.
Speaker A:But then things are going to.
Speaker A:They're going to get weird.
Speaker A:They're going to get weird.
Speaker B:So Sam tells Ruby, it's been weeks.
Speaker B:I need it.
Speaker B:Like, wait, what the fuck does he need?
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker B:So she climbs on his lap and I'm like, tell me this is not about demon pussy.
Speaker B:That's all I'm thinking, because I don't know.
Speaker B:And I'm like, she's getting all sexy up on his shit.
Speaker B:Like, what is going on?
Speaker A:This is.
Speaker A:We're in a very different direction in my.
Speaker B:What Am I supposed to think fair?
Speaker A:Fair.
Speaker A:Fair.
Speaker A:I'm saying this went to a very American Gods place for me.
Speaker A:And if you've watched American Gods, you'll get the reference.
Speaker A:But anyways, so no, it's not demon pussy.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:She climbs on him and says.
Speaker B:And says that he can have it.
Speaker B:And then she cuts her arm and he starts drinking her blood.
Speaker A:Gross.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's so gross.
Speaker A:And it's, you know, very vampire like, you know, we've got the.
Speaker A:And Sam is just like, oh, nom, nom, nom, nom, nom.
Speaker A:And she's like, it's so good.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's a very weird.
Speaker A:She's, like, having just, like, motherly things while he's doing it.
Speaker A:And that's also gross.
Speaker A:And then I'm just like, so how does this work?
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So does, like, the demon smoke infects the blood?
Speaker A:Because it's not like the blood of a person.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Because she's.
Speaker B:Because that's a.
Speaker B:That's a dead body.
Speaker B:She's walking around.
Speaker A:She's just.
Speaker A:Yeah, this is.
Speaker A:We're a coma person.
Speaker A:Whatever.
Speaker A:But so does a smoke just get into the blood of the coma person?
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:That's my question.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:Not well explained.
Speaker B:Not well explained at all.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker B:Processing that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:While we're processing this, we have Alastair still taunting Dean.
Speaker B:And Dean has a knife and he's dipped it in the holy water and he's got salt on it.
Speaker B:And he decides to go stab Alistair.
Speaker B:And Alastair is like.
Speaker B:Tells Dean, hey, there's no going back, you know, while Dean's, like, twisting this knife.
Speaker B:But as this is going on, they show us that something's happened with the plumbing around this room.
Speaker B:It's got some faulty fucking plumbing, apparently.
Speaker B:Or there's some magic amiss because a leak occurs and is dripping perfectly onto the edge of the Devil's Trap.
Speaker B:That's convenient.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:And so we're gonna go to another room.
Speaker A:Yeah, we're gonna cut to another location.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:Well, I guess they're cutting back to Castiel.
Speaker B:The room outside.
Speaker A:Yeah, I guess.
Speaker A:Maybe they are kind of bumping this, like, Cass.
Speaker A:Dean.
Speaker A:Like, it was like, Dean, Cass, Sam.
Speaker A:And then we went to Dean, and now we're back to Cass.
Speaker A:So I guess they are kind of going in a circle, but.
Speaker A:So now we're back in Cass's room and the lights go out.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And who shows up?
Speaker B:It's Anna.
Speaker B:She's back in her old human body.
Speaker B:Because apparently she pulled some favors to save her body, which is.
Speaker A:Yeah, they made.
Speaker A:They're just like, how do we cover this up?
Speaker A:Because we would like this actress to come back as Anna.
Speaker A:Well, fuck, okay.
Speaker A:I guess we can make up that she was sentimental and wanted her old form, so somehow this worked.
Speaker A:Okay, whatever.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:Accepting that and moving on.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:And you can hear while they're talking, you can hear Alistair's yells in the background, which is a little dark.
Speaker B:And they're basically.
Speaker B:Cassio says, look, there's still orders to kill you.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But in Uriel's gone getting receiving revelation, that's pretty much this conversation.
Speaker A:And she also, I guess.
Speaker A:Okay, we cut back to.
Speaker A:There's another cut back to Dean.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Just like Alistair.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker A:Taunting blood.
Speaker A:Whatever.
Speaker A:And then we cut back to Anna, who starts making some really good points,.
Speaker B:Like, why are you letting Dean do this?
Speaker B:And Castiel's like, oh, it's God's work.
Speaker B:She's like, torture is God's work.
Speaker B:Ah, it doesn't sound right.
Speaker B:That doesn't sound right.
Speaker B:You're ruining your best weapon by making him do this.
Speaker B:You're going to fucking break Dean, basically.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:No, you're going to break him.
Speaker A:You are literally going to break the weapon you have.
Speaker A:But also, this is a lot of like, any time you see like a zealot religion or something where they're like, this is God's work.
Speaker A:Like art, it Is it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Like, what, a loving, righteous God order this.
Speaker A:But also the Judaic Christian.
Speaker A:Yeah, maybe.
Speaker A:All right, so.
Speaker A:So they go back and forth.
Speaker A:We get the kind of like this religious thing and he is like, she's like, you know, a father that he loves wouldn't ask him is not righteous.
Speaker A:And she's just like what you're feeling, it's called doubt.
Speaker B:And he's mad about it.
Speaker B:He does not like feeling doubt.
Speaker A:Or maybe he just doesn't like feeling feelings.
Speaker B:Because remember, angels, like, they don't have.
Speaker A:They've never really like.
Speaker A:And I think we kind of go into this mythology here, like this supernatural mythology of how much emotions are these creatures allowed to have.
Speaker A:Because maybe it is just this doubt that starts bringing forth those emotions more.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:There's all the things that Anna was talking about that she didn't want to give up.
Speaker A:Like all the feelings, all the things that you had as a human.
Speaker A:But doubting God, that's still an emotion, right?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, yeah, maybe that starts sparking things inside them.
Speaker B:Yeah, no, for sure.
Speaker B:And it's an interesting point that she's making.
Speaker B:I think in an interesting conversation, it really shows a bit of her humanity that she acquired while living amongst us heathens, the Hoover.
Speaker B:So Dean is pouring holy water down on Alastairs still, as Anna continues to talk to Castiel into joining with her to fight wrongs.
Speaker B:Castiel gets pissed at this point, though.
Speaker B:He's like, no, you need to leave.
Speaker A:Well, I mean, if you think about it, because you just like, wait a minute.
Speaker A:You're trying to get me to rebel.
Speaker A:So if you have somebody who was in, say, a cult, and then somebody comes up to them was like, what.
Speaker B:You're doing is wrong.
Speaker A:The will, it's wrong.
Speaker A:And they're like, wait, they told me you were gonna do this?
Speaker A:Is exactly what they said.
Speaker A:You're trying to make me rebel.
Speaker A:I catch you on that.
Speaker A:And then she's like, I can't argue with you.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So we get back to Alistair's shit talking.
Speaker B:Still lots of taunting, but starts to mention something about Lilith at this point, though.
Speaker B:And that gets.
Speaker B:Gets the attention a little bit about Lilith and what her intent for Dean is.
Speaker B:We get another quick cut back to Sam because he is driving and looking very intense about it.
Speaker A:He is so determined.
Speaker A:He has got the most determined.
Speaker A:I am driving.
Speaker B:Very serious.
Speaker B:Very serious.
Speaker A:Gonna go.
Speaker B:So anyways, so Alistair's coughing up all this foamy blood.
Speaker B:It's pretty gross.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Because Deed was pouring salt down his throat as well as torture things, which I said basically, like he was making foie gras because it looked like the tube that you put down a goose's throat before you make.
Speaker A:Or a duck's throat before you fatten up their liver, which is perfectly fine.
Speaker A:Grasp demonic foie gras and.
Speaker A:But in reality, that was actually sugar.
Speaker A:So he.
Speaker A:But that's still a lot of shit to get poured down your throat.
Speaker A:So the actor basically was like.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's why I was able to like, cough and sputter so much because I had all this sugar that was poured down my throat.
Speaker B:Yeah, gross, Gross.
Speaker B:Yeah, so.
Speaker B:And he's talking about.
Speaker B:While he's coughing all this stuff, this nasty foam up.
Speaker B:He's talking about the first time Dean grabbed his razor and sliced into a Weeping Bitch.
Speaker B:So talking about the first person that Dean tortured.
Speaker B:And anyway, so he starts trying to allude to about Dean being a seal himself.
Speaker B:Because when a righteous man sheds blood in hell, when he breaks, the seal breaks.
Speaker B:So now we've got kind of a big potential revelation and reveal in the story is that the first seal, which is the domino effect for any of the other seals to be able to be broken apparently.
Speaker B:Which is even more complicated.
Speaker B:But okay.
Speaker B:Was Dean actually breaking for Alistair?
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:And that it was supposed to be John.
Speaker A:That they were trying to get John to break the seal and John didn't do it and then he was taken away and Dean came back and.
Speaker B:But here's the question.
Speaker B:Did John know?
Speaker B:And is this some other.
Speaker B:John didn't tell the boys because that'd be up.
Speaker B:But I guess we'll find out.
Speaker A:It seems like something he would do, right?
Speaker B:It does.
Speaker B:I didn't tell you.
Speaker B:I didn't tell you if you're on.
Speaker A:Good.
Speaker A:Sorry.
Speaker A:Like I went to heaven.
Speaker A:I forgot to give you this piece of information.
Speaker A:But I think like if the righteous.
Speaker A:I don't know because it would take longer to break the righteous ban if he knew.
Speaker A:But anyway, so that's the first seal which is, you know, in some.
Speaker A:Some point.
Speaker A:There's no like I'm trying to avoid it.
Speaker A:And you'll see when we get into the angel discussion later today that the reason I'm trying to avoid delving into apocalypse lore is because it's also a bunch of bullshit.
Speaker A:That is not the first seal of the apocalypse according to the Revelation according to John in the accepted canon for the Bible.
Speaker A:That's not it.
Speaker A:However, this is in the supernatural canon.
Speaker A:This was the first seal and Dean started the apocalypse.
Speaker A:Oops.
Speaker B:Oopsie daisy.
Speaker B:So he obviously Dean's like wait, what?
Speaker B:And Alistair's like no, I'm not lying.
Speaker B:But at this point Alistair has also noticed the water drip that has broken his devil's trap.
Speaker B:So Dean is real upset and turns puts his back to Alistair for way too long then turns around to kill him but too late because Alastair's already freed himself from the trap and is going to beat the fuck out of Dean.
Speaker B:Basically what happens here.
Speaker B:He really beats the shit out of him.
Speaker B:He does.
Speaker A:He beats the shit out of him.
Speaker A:Oh, it was bad.
Speaker A:But yeah.
Speaker A:So then he ends up picking him up by his throat.
Speaker A:Throat.
Speaker A:He's got him by his throat.
Speaker A:That's not good.
Speaker B:My kid says that he'll see him back in class but then right then Castiel comes in and stabs Alistair in the back.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker A:But he doesn't kill him.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Which is the weird or not one in the back but he stabs him.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But it's weird because it doesn't kill him.
Speaker B:And he's like, did he miss?
Speaker B:Alastair's like Looks like God is on my side today.
Speaker B:And so Cass is like, trying to spin this blade to kind of like using his angel powers from a distance to try to like, I guess, kill Alistair.
Speaker B:But it's not working.
Speaker B:And Alistair just pulls it out.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:So, I mean, this is the demon knife.
Speaker A:It's supposed to kill all demons, but I guess he's too powerful for it to work on.
Speaker A:So they fight.
Speaker B:Dean's completely unconscious.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Dean takes a nap and the angel and the demon fight.
Speaker A:And then Cass gets hung on a hook and it's.
Speaker A:That's not good.
Speaker A:I don't like that look.
Speaker A:Painful.
Speaker A:No like that at all.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:But an interesting line here which really seals that the angels or the angels that were dying were not killed by the demons.
Speaker B:Which is the whole point of this whole fucking exercise was when Alistair is like, I wish I knew how to kill you.
Speaker B:I just know how to send you back to heaven.
Speaker B:So if Alistair doesn't know how it doesn't know who's killing the angels and doesn't even know how to kill a fucking angel, then it's probably not the fucking demons.
Speaker B:It's probably what we're piecing together at this point.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:However, he does know an angel exorcism.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:Which is exciting.
Speaker A:So we find a new thing.
Speaker A:So, like, okay, so now we can have an angel exorcism.
Speaker B:Cool.
Speaker B:So he starts the incantation and you see Castiel's eyes and mouth start glowing blue, white.
Speaker A:I just.
Speaker A:Basically he starts to glow through his holes.
Speaker A:Get the whole glow.
Speaker B:Got the whole glow.
Speaker A:Got the whole glow.
Speaker B:So Sam walks in though, right on time, and does his.
Speaker B:Sam psychic fling.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:He starts hand jabbing.
Speaker A:Him.
Speaker A:He's just hand jabbing away.
Speaker A:Giving him a hand job.
Speaker B:Psychic hand job.
Speaker A:Psychic hand job.
Speaker A:You keep saying jab.
Speaker B:I'm saying job.
Speaker A:No, I'm trying to get you to say psychic hand job.
Speaker A:They're like, nope, nope.
Speaker A:Psychic hand job.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker A:So the Alistair is like, dude, Lilith is.
Speaker A:Is behind this.
Speaker A:She wouldn't stop with seven.
Speaker A:She's like.
Speaker B:She'd kill it.
Speaker B:100,000.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Billy is so strong.
Speaker B:But so now Alistair is taunting Sam because that's what he does.
Speaker B:And he's like, yeah, send me back if you can, motherfucker.
Speaker A:Oh, no.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:And then we get to this and.
Speaker B:Sam was like, sam, I'm stronger than that now.
Speaker B:I can kill.
Speaker A:Ew.
Speaker A:Sorry, Mr. Padalecki.
Speaker A:The delivery of this line, it's terrible.
Speaker A:I know you didn't have a lot to work with, but it's not great.
Speaker A:It's just not great.
Speaker B:Now I can kill.
Speaker B:Castiel's watching this and he looks very confused and concerned.
Speaker A:He's just like, what?
Speaker A:That is the best part of this.
Speaker B:Is Collins'reaction his face.
Speaker B:Like he looks like what the fuck is happening at all times.
Speaker B:That's pretty much what it looks like.
Speaker B:So yeah, he uses his psychic power powers to kill Alistair against the wall.
Speaker A:And so like Alistair is dead.
Speaker A:And very surprised.
Speaker B:Like the shock that he is dead,.
Speaker A:His face when he dies is so great because it's just like the eyes are so wide.
Speaker A:Like the mouth is open.
Speaker A:He's just like, I'm dead.
Speaker A:Like, what?
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:Yeah, so.
Speaker B:Yeah, so yeah, so he had a surprise.
Speaker A:But Cass is.
Speaker A:He is not abused.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:And we cut from this scene to the hospital because.
Speaker A:Okay, one thing before we go over there.
Speaker A:I just do want to mention that one.
Speaker A:The killing, the special effects while they killed Alistair was really great.
Speaker A:I like the kind of like the skeleton, like.
Speaker A:Yeah, apparently it was a lot bigger.
Speaker A:And they pulled it back like in the edits because they want to leave something, you know, in case they're successful and Lilith dies.
Speaker A:We don't know if Lilith is going to die.
Speaker A:This is.
Speaker A:We're not there yet.
Speaker A:But in case they're like, well, we want to leave the store open.
Speaker A:So they pulled less.
Speaker A:But I still thought it was a really great like death scene.
Speaker A:Beyond the super surprised it was to me it was very Josh Whedon, Buffy type.
Speaker A:You know that type of like vampire dying.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:Like it was a special death, I guess.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:All right, so now we're going to.
Speaker B:Be in a hospital and Dean's on a respirator.
Speaker A:Oh, I don't look good.
Speaker A:At least it's pre covered and he can get a respirator.
Speaker A:Good for you.
Speaker B:So Sam's sitting with him and Castell walks by.
Speaker B:Sam is pissed though.
Speaker B:He's like, go miracle him back.
Speaker B:Like you and Uriel couldn't, you know, keep a simple devil's trap together.
Speaker B:And so this is all your fault.
Speaker B:And Castell's like, I don't know why it broke.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:That shouldn't have been a breakable trap.
Speaker B:And Sam's like, no, it was all pointless.
Speaker B:Alistair was right.
Speaker B:It wasn't.
Speaker B:It's not demons killing the angels, so.
Speaker A:And I don't understand why say why Cass can't heal.
Speaker A:He'll heal deep.
Speaker A:Like no matter what's going on.
Speaker A:Like, it's just.
Speaker B:I think it's a can't.
Speaker B:I think it's a won't because he's such a rule follower.
Speaker A:But what's the rule?
Speaker A:Like, I don't know.
Speaker A:Like, he.
Speaker A:That, like.
Speaker B:And they've intervened a lot, but I don't know if they're supposed to.
Speaker B:I think there's probably a limitation on their intervention.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I think it's stupid.
Speaker A:I think he should boop Dean on the head and heal him.
Speaker A:This is stupid.
Speaker A:All right, so.
Speaker A:But we're going to cut to Uriel, who's just orgasming on a bench somewhere.
Speaker B:Because he just received his revelation.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:The face on you.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:Sorry, sir.
Speaker A:No, thank you.
Speaker A:I didn't need to see that.
Speaker B:The Powers don't want them to keep hunting what's killing the angels now.
Speaker B:Wait, what?
Speaker B:That's stupid.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Also, like, I like going into people and they're like, oh.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker A:I just talked to the bosses.
Speaker A:Thursday is fine.
Speaker A:We don't have to kill the demons anymore.
Speaker A:Just in case you're wondering.
Speaker A:We have to stop hunting them.
Speaker A:That's what the bosses say.
Speaker A:Okay, like, you got that right.
Speaker A:You know, it was real because I was having that word out in face.
Speaker A:Cool.
Speaker B:And Castiel does kind of start, like, sharing a little bit of doubts.
Speaker B:He's like.
Speaker B:Like, he's.
Speaker B:He's doing some critical thinking a little bit.
Speaker B:Not fully, but a little bit.
Speaker B:He's like, maybe is our.
Speaker B:You think our Garrison's being punished, you know, for losing the war?
Speaker B:And maybe it's not Father giving our orders right now, but I just don't really get what's going on kind of thing.
Speaker B:And Uriel is not happy any of these.
Speaker A:That's pretty much no.
Speaker A:And he's like, I'm not gonna wait to be gutted.
Speaker A:I'm gonna flap off.
Speaker A:And he flaps off, and Cass is like, well, shit, I guess I need a redhead to save the day.
Speaker A:Like you often do.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:There you go.
Speaker B:So he's gonna go talk to Anna again.
Speaker B:And, like, he tells her that he's considering disobedience and that he fails for the first time.
Speaker A:And also, she's in a long coat now, and I don't know if I didn't notice it the other way, but I'm like, is that so Know you.
Speaker A:You can flap off.
Speaker A:Like, why.
Speaker A:Why does everyone.
Speaker A:Like, why do all you angels have to have long coats?
Speaker A:It don't make sense.
Speaker B:Is it to cover their wings?
Speaker A:But they're hidden.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:But she's in a Long coat now.
Speaker A:And it's weird, all right.
Speaker B:And she's.
Speaker B:She explains that just.
Speaker B:It's really, like, terrifying to choose your own path.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And Castle, you know, it's a.
Speaker B:He calls her back in this whole thing because he wants to know what to do, and she's like, no, I can't really tell you what to do.
Speaker B:You've got to think for yourself.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker B:Yeah, because he's just looking for any kind of instruction.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But also, I mean, like, for all of time, you have followed instructions, and then all of a sudden you, like, think for yourself.
Speaker A:You're like, what?
Speaker B:That's a lot of pressure.
Speaker A:A lot.
Speaker A:There's a lot of pressure.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker B:So he sees a water.
Speaker B:A water spigot at the water fountain.
Speaker B:So he starts thinking about what happened.
Speaker A:Okay, so that.
Speaker A:This is where I have.
Speaker A:What the fuck is that called, you stupid Covid brain.
Speaker A:The thing that turns, like, on your faucet is that.
Speaker A:That's where the water comes out of.
Speaker A:What's the knobby thing?
Speaker A:Like, that has a name, doesn't it?
Speaker A:Like, I swear that has a name and, like, just Covid ate it.
Speaker A:I think Covid ate the name for whatever that thing is.
Speaker A:It goes on the wall and it's just the twisty.
Speaker B:The twisty part that makes the valve.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker A:Is it a valve?
Speaker A:I don't know where my house is.
Speaker A:Like, it opens the valve and then I'm like.
Speaker A:I started getting very concerned.
Speaker A:I'm like, why can't I remember what this was called?
Speaker B:Yeah, I've got spigot, valve and faucet.
Speaker B:That's what I got.
Speaker B:Spigot, valve and faucet.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Yeah, but he's obviously.
Speaker B:But so Castiel decides to go and investigate how the devil's trap was broken by this water drippage.
Speaker B:Because he was certain that this shitty ass old warehouse had perfect plumbing when they decided, right?
Speaker A:I mean, clearly this.
Speaker A:This warehouse has been abandoned, clearly, for a very long time and still has water attached.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:Nothing is gonna leak.
Speaker A:Ever.
Speaker B:Of course not.
Speaker A:In my, like, house that is probably, what, like, five years old?
Speaker A:Nothing ever leaks here.
Speaker B:Never.
Speaker B:No, no, nonsense.
Speaker A:No, no.
Speaker A:I could clearly turn on both the hot and the cold water or turn on that weird thing that I don't know the name of outside without water spitting everywhere.
Speaker A:Whatever the thing is spits water anyhow.
Speaker A:So Cass is just like, wait a minute.
Speaker A:Shit's fucked.
Speaker A:I'm going to call Uriel.
Speaker A:And he's like, uriel, isn't this Weird.
Speaker B:Mm.
Speaker B:He's like, no.
Speaker B:Alstair is just stronger than we thought.
Speaker B:That's all.
Speaker B:Sorry.
Speaker B:Don't think about it anymore.
Speaker B:And Castella's like, I don't really know.
Speaker B:Let's.
Speaker B:Let's talk about this.
Speaker B:I need the truth.
Speaker B:And Uriel drops the truth, which is a fucking knife in his sleeve.
Speaker A:That's the truth.
Speaker A:So we've got an angel blade.
Speaker A:Oh, no.
Speaker A:And we find out it was him.
Speaker B:The truth is, the only thing that can kill an angel is another angel.
Speaker B:And my note says, oh, shit.
Speaker A:Oh, shit.
Speaker A:And basically, he also just wanted Dean to die.
Speaker A:He just figured that he would be taken out and his problem would be solved.
Speaker B:Well, and he didn't even want to take Alistair alive.
Speaker B:He thought.
Speaker B:He thought that was inconvenient.
Speaker B:And then he was like, well, it'll work itself out because Alistair will kill Dean.
Speaker B:They'll be fine.
Speaker B:So Uriel wants to convert all the angels in his garrison against God and against humanity.
Speaker B:So he wants them all to join together to help raise their brother, Lucifer.
Speaker B:Yeah, this.
Speaker B:This.
Speaker B:This is not.
Speaker B:Not the plan that Castell signed up for.
Speaker A:No, No.
Speaker A:I think it's probably the opposite.
Speaker A:And he is like, yeah, Lucifer, he was so strong and beautiful.
Speaker A:He didn't bow to humans.
Speaker A:He was defending us.
Speaker A:Oops.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And Cassio's like, lucifer is not God.
Speaker B:And you're like, God isn't God anymore.
Speaker B:It doesn't care what we do.
Speaker B:I'm proof of that.
Speaker B:Well, and that's actually.
Speaker A:But he's actually.
Speaker A:He's not wrong.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:He's just like, look, like, where is God?
Speaker A:Why is God not stopping me?
Speaker A:I'm doing some real shitty things and.
Speaker B:No one's stopping me.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And Castiel's like, what are you going to do?
Speaker B:Kill the whole garrison?
Speaker B:And here he says, only the ones that say, no, don't fight me.
Speaker B:Help me spread the word.
Speaker B:Bring the apocalypse.
Speaker B:That doesn't sound fun.
Speaker A:No.
Speaker A:No, it doesn't.
Speaker A:And just basically, like, anytime anybody is shouting, help me bring on the apocalypse,.
Speaker B:The answer is no, thank you.
Speaker A:Probably probably shouldn't be talking to them.
Speaker A:That probably.
Speaker A:Probably not.
Speaker B:So we get angel fight.
Speaker A:And so.
Speaker A:And he's just like, all you have to do is be unafraid.
Speaker A:And we get this badass Cassiel.
Speaker A:He is like, yeah, for the first time in a long time, I am.
Speaker A:And then he's just like.
Speaker A:Punches Uriel, like, right through a wall.
Speaker A:There's like, fight, fight, fight.
Speaker A:So, however, I think it's time that we talk about Uriel.
Speaker A:And why I hate shit.
Speaker B:Is this lore?
Speaker A:This is lore, but also just Liz is ranting about angels.
Speaker A:And so I told Diana when I was like, look, when I watched this episode, I was in a place.
Speaker A:When I finished up research, I was in place.
Speaker A:This is very.
Speaker A:I had a very angry episode.
Speaker A:And part of it is this shit about angels.
Speaker A:Do you know how hard it is to find actual historical things outside of the library?
Speaker A:Which I have not had the privilege of leaving my house to go to a library because the world is still on fire.
Speaker A:And so I am limited to the databases and things that I can, I can access.
Speaker A:But in general, if you start looking up shit about angels, you're going to get this hippie dippy crap of all these people who want to be touched by a goddamn angel.
Speaker A:And they're just like, I wanted, like have beings of light and this is how you talk to them.
Speaker A:But that's not where angels come from.
Speaker A:And it fucking frustrates me.
Speaker B:So the angels are warriors.
Speaker B:They weren't nice.
Speaker B:That was the whole thing.
Speaker A:They weren't nice, but also not.
Speaker A:Besides not being real.
Speaker A:One of the reasons that this is really hard is that angels weren't even really in the Bible, right?
Speaker A:So in the canonical Bible, which is what is accepted as Christian dogma, right?
Speaker A:And the problem with this too is that there are so many different versions of the Bible with the accepted books that go into them, right?
Speaker A:So we have this whole other thing that I'll get into a minute.
Speaker A:But so in the technical Bible that is recognized, like the King James version, really, like, angels aren't really in there.
Speaker A:They're like kind of superfluous.
Speaker A:And we don't really talk about, like, there's.
Speaker A:There's some things that go in there, but if you really look through it, you're not going to see this, right?
Speaker A:So we're not going to get that history of it.
Speaker A:And really within, like the Judaic mythology, they were even really a thing historically until those tribes started hanging out with the Zoroastrians.
Speaker A:So while, while the Hebrews were exiled into the desert, they met up with the Zoroastrians is apparently how this goes.
Speaker A:So we've talked about Zoroaster before, you know, being.
Speaker A:Being like one of those great mythical people, started religions, people followed them.
Speaker A:So he believed he was assisted and taught by the immortal holy ones, who were six arch archangels.
Speaker A:And he was also, he talked to a lot of other angels, like figured out there was a duality and had.
Speaker A:There was a Lord of darkness, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker A:Blah.
Speaker A:So a lot of these things end up being adopted by other religions, including Judaism.
Speaker A:And then therefore Christianity falls following afterwards.
Speaker A:So they just kind of get shoved into different books.
Speaker A:So like they're in some books and they're not in other books.
Speaker A:And the Christian church didn't acknowledge they actually existed until the first you can medical council in 325 AD.
Speaker A:So like, for the first 325 years of Christianity, like, they don't even say angels are a thing, right?
Speaker A:And then at that point they're like, yeah, all right, angels are cool.
Speaker A:Christians can ask them to get into heaven.
Speaker A:And then the council met again 20 years later and they're like, yeah, that kind of seems like worshiping idols, so let's take that back.
Speaker A:So then they take shit back from them.
Speaker A:Then like in 787 AD, the seventh ecumenical synod happens.
Speaker A:And then they're just like, you know what?
Speaker A:Now we can say angels are intermediaries.
Speaker A:They can intercede between God and man.
Speaker A:And we're going to have the celestial order and that's.
Speaker A:We're going to get things like there's like three orders of angels.
Speaker A:You'll have seraphim, cherub and thrones, blah, blah, blah, archangels, angels, all that other shit.
Speaker A: s been happening for the past: Speaker A:Like, people are just like, kind of randomly picking like what part of this lore they want to go through.
Speaker A:And then of course you have the fucking hippies that are just like messing everything up, because they do.
Speaker B:And so that's what they do.
Speaker A:So that's how we get to kind of where we are today.
Speaker A:So but to Uriel specifically, and there's a lot of different names or Uriel, sometimes Ariel, sometimes there's.
Speaker A:There's all these different shit that can go be called like the same angel.
Speaker A:And depending on what beliefs you want to run with.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Or whatever is fitting the thing that you're trying to do.
Speaker A:Sometimes it's a. Uriel is a feminine angel, sometimes it's masculine, so sometimes the sheets.
Speaker B:And that's the he.
Speaker A:And unlike.
Speaker A:So there are some angels that are mentioned in the canon of, of Christianity.
Speaker A:So like Michael Gabriel, Raphael, those are all in there.
Speaker A:But Uriel's not.
Speaker A:So you're actually not going to find the name of Uriel anywhere in the Bible, but he's still a very popular angel.
Speaker A:He's a big player in the Book of Enoch, which is one of the apocrypha, which are These, the.
Speaker A:Some of the books that were left out of canon.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So you had to think about as the canon and just the general scriptures in general for any type of religion are being made.
Speaker A:They're being made on their time.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So the documentation of what happened in the times of the person of Jesus Christ and etc.
Speaker A:There's like story after story and then basically somebody went through and said, these things are cool, these things are not.
Speaker A:So one of the books that was very popular was the Book of Enoch.
Speaker A:However, that was decided that it would not be included.
Speaker A:Included into the main canon of the Bible.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:Within the Book of Enoch, this is like where we get a lot of shit about angels.
Speaker A:A lot of that is coming from there.
Speaker A:And Uriel in this book is Enoch's guide.
Speaker A:And he basically takes him on this tour through heaven.
Speaker A:And that's how we kind of like learn about what angels are and what they're doing.
Speaker A:And so these next things are coming from different sources because, like I said, is a fucking mess.
Speaker A:So one he is, is sometimes called the holy angel who watches over humanities.
Speaker A:So he's in charge of thunder and earthquakes.
Speaker A:So that's.
Speaker A:According to some people, he does that.
Speaker A:This is not debated.
Speaker A:Well, kind of really.
Speaker A:The name Uriel itself means God is my light or fire of God.
Speaker A:And if you look at those two things, those are two very different ideas.
Speaker A:God is my light, fire of God.
Speaker A:I'm gonna.
Speaker B:I mean, you get light from fire.
Speaker B:I mean.
Speaker B:But still.
Speaker B:Yeah, that doesn't sound.
Speaker B:Yeah, the tone is quite different.
Speaker A:The tone is quite different.
Speaker A:And like I said, there's different versions of the name for this angel.
Speaker A:So depending on which name you use.
Speaker A:And there could be different things.
Speaker A:However, the idea is basically Uriel taught the Torah to Moses and that is where the fire of God comes from.
Speaker A:There's another apocryphal book called Estras, and in that he rebuked and shamed the prophet for assuming too much about the ways of God.
Speaker A:So I think that kind of plays into this character a bit.
Speaker A:Just have like, oh, you know, like, I know what's better.
Speaker A:Like, you can't, like, because you doubted this, I'm going to set you on fire, whatever.
Speaker A:Because I'm the flame of God and the sibling oracles.
Speaker A:He's mentioned as the angel who looks after the keys to hell and is waiting to open the gates on judgment day.
Speaker A:So I think that would kind of go into the storyline a bit, you know, like, that he's really wants to bring on the apocalypse.
Speaker A:Frances Barrett who was the author of the Magus.
Speaker A:She wrote that Uriel brought the gift of alchemy to mankind.
Speaker A:This is actually a pretty interesting notion.
Speaker A:So basically, there is within Enoch and someday we'll go down to the world of Enoch.
Speaker A:The idea is, is that the angels are these watchers.
Speaker A:They come down and they get enticed by women and they want to fuck them.
Speaker A:They start fucking the women and telling them all their secrets about warfare and other things, including alchemy.
Speaker A:So that the angels are the ones who give the.
Speaker A:How do you turn rocks into gold or whatever you want to do, right?
Speaker A:Which is all about making money.
Speaker A:So in the writings of John Dee, who is known as Queen Elizabeth, the first Conjurer, which is how.
Speaker A:Where we get Enochian language from.
Speaker A:And this will be a very other episode that'll happen probably in the next few weeks.
Speaker A:It's sitting there.
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker A:It's a big.
Speaker A:It's a big story.
Speaker A:And I'm just.
Speaker A:I'm holding it, holding it to my heart so I can later tell you.
Speaker A:You just wait.
Speaker A:You'll hear about John D. That's gonna be amazing.
Speaker A:But anyway, so John D. Is like, yeah, Uriel tells me all the shit.
Speaker A:So all these other, like, people who are interested in alchemy and magician at the time really get into Uriel because John D. Says he heard from them.
Speaker A:So now he becomes more popular.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:He's also said to be the one who is responsible for giving man the Kabbalah.
Speaker A:So in the Judaic magician mythology, then we also have him being a very big, important role there.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker A:And so the last thing is, like, we're still going to get the new age hippie shit.
Speaker A:Like, as Archangel, the earth Uriel is at his peak in spring and summer.
Speaker A:He is the angel in charge of the month of September.
Speaker A:He is responsible for the ripening of the crops and for looking after all of nature.
Speaker A:His direction is north.
Speaker A:Uriel's personal season is.
Speaker A:Is winter.
Speaker A:I fucking hate that shit.
Speaker A:Like, every time I see that, like, on any.
Speaker B:Sounds like some like, horoscope shit.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker A:It's all fucking horoscope shit.
Speaker A:And it's just like, oh, do you want to have change?
Speaker A:Then you should invoke the angel Uriel.
Speaker A:Uriel is great in transformation.
Speaker A:He.
Speaker A:He's in winter.
Speaker A:He's not an autumn.
Speaker A:He tried the purples.
Speaker A:It's not look good on his skin.
Speaker A:He is a winter.
Speaker A:He needs to go with dark blues and jewel colors, you know, and at that point, like, I'm Fucking done.
Speaker A:I hate angels.
Speaker A:The end.
Speaker A:That's the end of lore.
Speaker A:You angels.
Speaker B:Did you end that with you angels?
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker B:Speaking of angels, I'm watching Angel right now.
Speaker B:Yeah, sorry, change of subject.
Speaker B:I thought I'd share.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So anyways, I'm still in season one, but either way, I watched several episodes this weekend.
Speaker A:No, I taunted you again.
Speaker A:And like, until you get to certain characters, you have not watched Angel.
Speaker A:If not.
Speaker A:And you've got.
Speaker A:I honestly think you could skip the first season.
Speaker B:Babe saw it on the.
Speaker B:Babe saw it on the.
Speaker B:On the guide on Hulu.
Speaker B:And he goes, hey, it's that guy from Bones.
Speaker B:I'm like, babe.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:But also it's really weird if you like jump between David Boreanas and Angel Will go Buffy, Angel Bones, SEAL team and whatever his name is.
Speaker B:No, it's something like seals or seal something.
Speaker A:Seals, whatever.
Speaker A:He's aged well.
Speaker B:Oh yeah.
Speaker A:David Gorianis is.
Speaker A:You're a good looking man.
Speaker A:But like watching him is like young, like very emo.
Speaker A:Like new wavy angel to just like.
Speaker A:Well, I am, you know, army man or navy man, whatever.
Speaker B:But yeah, so, all right,.
Speaker A:He's just like.
Speaker A:Cassiel's like, I serve God.
Speaker A:And then Duriel's like, you haven't even met the man.
Speaker A:And I'm like, whoa, brutal.
Speaker B:Brutal.
Speaker B:And Cassiel's like, you can't win.
Speaker B:But either way.
Speaker B:So they're fighting.
Speaker B:They're fighting.
Speaker B:But then who shows up?
Speaker B:Anna.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:And she's gonna say before.
Speaker A:Before we get to how much of a badass it is.
Speaker A:The other dark thing he said it was like, there is no will, no wrath.
Speaker A:No God.
Speaker A:Yeah, that is up.
Speaker A:If you think about like this is this angel who we just went through some of the shit where he said.
Speaker B:He's supposed to be the fucking light of God.
Speaker B:And he just said, there's no God.
Speaker A:There's no God.
Speaker A:What the fuck is happening?
Speaker B:Right, so which One hell of a loss of faith.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So we have an archangel who's basically saying, I don't believe in God anymore.
Speaker A:I'm just going to serve my own purposes.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's pretty heavy.
Speaker A:Until you get stabbed in the neck by Anna and she's all badass.
Speaker A:Do you want to US Airline?
Speaker B:Maybe not.
Speaker B:But they're still me.
Speaker A:Oh, damn.
Speaker A:Such a good line.
Speaker A:Yeah, they're still me.
Speaker A:I would someday, like, I don't know.
Speaker A:I just.
Speaker A:That that closing line is just like.
Speaker B:Having a good closing line is always a good feeling.
Speaker B:I don't care.
Speaker A:She got the last Word in.
Speaker A:Like, it's like, there's me stab you in the neck.
Speaker B:And I'm just impressed that she thought of it.
Speaker B:Then instead of, like, not, like, six hours later, I'm trying to go to bed and she's all stressed out.
Speaker A:She's like, God damn it.
Speaker A:That's what I should have said.
Speaker A:But nor you.
Speaker A:Like, I probably would have been like, but they're still Nike.
Speaker A:And I'm like, what?
Speaker B:Why are you.
Speaker B:So anyway, we get the glowy light.
Speaker A:Look at the light show.
Speaker A:And I was.
Speaker A:And then I said, it looks like an emp.
Speaker A:Maybe that's what happened to your garage doors.
Speaker B:So as a quick tidbit on it is both.
Speaker B:All of the programming on both.
Speaker B:Two separate unit garage doors.
Speaker B:Two separate things completely.
Speaker B:All the programming went dead on at the same time.
Speaker B:And they wouldn't hold programs anymore.
Speaker B:I'm like, it was a fucking emp.
Speaker B:And I was like, probably not.
Speaker B:Probably not.
Speaker B:My partner,.
Speaker A:Maybe somebody.
Speaker A:Somebody, like, stabbed an angel in the neck.
Speaker A:And that's why you couldn't open your garage door.
Speaker B:Sure, sure.
Speaker B:Anyway, so we get his light glowing out of Uriel's mouth and eyes and he's on the ground.
Speaker B:And he leaves a big burned silhouette of wings on the floor as he.
Speaker A:Did see, like, the beginning.
Speaker A:Thanks.
Speaker A:But at least you notice in this time.
Speaker A:So maybe this.
Speaker A:This could potentially be a trope.
Speaker B:Yes, apparently.
Speaker A:Maybe.
Speaker B:Apparently.
Speaker A:We may see this again.
Speaker B:I'm gonna guess so, since they made a big deal about it.
Speaker B:So we also.
Speaker A:Honestly, I really do love this effect.
Speaker B:Like, I think wings on the ground.
Speaker B:No, it's really.
Speaker B:It's a really good visual.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker B:I guess I was so focused on everything else that I missed it in the first.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:But Dean is now off a ventilator.
Speaker B:He just has the oxygen to his nose.
Speaker B:And so.
Speaker B:And Castiel's with him and asks if Dean's all right.
Speaker B:And it's like, no thanks to you.
Speaker B:And you need to be more careful.
Speaker A:In a hospital that.
Speaker A:I'm like, look at me.
Speaker A:Like, am I okay?
Speaker B:And Castell's like, you need to be more careful.
Speaker B:Like, what the.
Speaker B:You didn't.
Speaker B:Boop.
Speaker A:Like, you could just go like this.
Speaker B:You can boot me.
Speaker B:You can boot me better.
Speaker A:Myself on the forehead.
Speaker B:I know you are.
Speaker B:Boot me better.
Speaker A:Boot me hard, baby.
Speaker A:Boot me.
Speaker B:Boot me so hard.
Speaker B:And Dean's like, no, you need to learn to manage a fucking devil's trap.
Speaker B:I obviously didn't say fucking.
Speaker B:But that's basically.
Speaker A:And I think that was also in his mind.
Speaker A:It's like, what the fuck?
Speaker A:Like, you can't even have a devil's trap.
Speaker B:And this, and this.
Speaker B:I wrote a lot of the notes down on the quotes of this.
Speaker B:I won't fucking go back and forth.
Speaker B:But basically, Cassiel's like, no, that's not what I mean.
Speaker B:Uriel's dead.
Speaker B:I'm being disobedient.
Speaker B:He was working against us.
Speaker B:And he's like, is it true?
Speaker B:Did I break the first seal and start all this?
Speaker B:And Castiel tells him, yeah, we laid siege.
Speaker B:We laid siege to hell when we realized what was happening, but it was too late.
Speaker B:And that's.
Speaker B:That is what it is.
Speaker A:It's not your fault.
Speaker A:It's fate.
Speaker A:So I also think this is.
Speaker A:I kind of want to see this.
Speaker A:Like, I think this is a very interesting, interesting thing that's alluded to and we don't see, right, is angels laid.
Speaker B:Siege to hell to try to prevent Dean from Dean before he broke.
Speaker A:That's pretty awesome.
Speaker A:And, like, so.
Speaker A:And so that means we got to you.
Speaker A:And it was too late, but so they still, like, ripped him from where he was doing torture.
Speaker A:And I think this is the greatest, like, visual late picture they painted.
Speaker A:But I wanted to see it for real.
Speaker B:That would have been a great thing to see for sure.
Speaker B:When they're telling the story.
Speaker B:I would like that, too.
Speaker B:But, Cassie, like you said, he does fate.
Speaker B:He's like, look, the righteous man who break, who begins this, is the only one who can finish it.
Speaker B:You have to stop it.
Speaker B:So he has to stop the fucking Apocalypse.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And Dean's like, what the fuck?
Speaker B:How.
Speaker B:How do I do that?
Speaker B:What does that mean?
Speaker B:And Cassie, I was like, I don't know.
Speaker B:I just know it.
Speaker B:I just know you have to do it.
Speaker B:Which is a terrible response.
Speaker A:You go fuck yourself, man.
Speaker A:You can't tell me, like, you have.
Speaker A:Not even mad, but there's.
Speaker A:There's no instruction book.
Speaker A:No, just do it.
Speaker B:Just do it.
Speaker A:You accidentally fucked your way into this.
Speaker B:Unfuck it accidentally, too.
Speaker A:You've got to unfuck it somehow.
Speaker A:Yeah, okay.
Speaker A:And then we get defeated.
Speaker A:I don't like sad Dean.
Speaker B:You think that he'd be mad by this response.
Speaker B:And I think a lot of times we've seen Dean get mad to responses like this, but he's not mad this time.
Speaker B:He's sad and he is crying and tells Castiel, I can't do it.
Speaker B:It's too big and I'm not strong enough.
Speaker B:You need to find someone else.
Speaker B:It's not me.
Speaker A:And that's how they end with a single man tear.
Speaker B:So did Dean get broken again?
Speaker B:Like he was broken in hell and then now he's broken by his own fate?
Speaker A:Is that.
Speaker B:I mean, like, that's how it comes across, right?
Speaker B:Like in a different way, but it's a different kind of breaking.
Speaker B:He's breaking.
Speaker B:They pushed him to his breaking point.
Speaker A:Well, I think it's also.
Speaker A:This is, you know, as everybody has.
Speaker A:I was like, as a person who has you experience, you know, insecurity.
Speaker A:If you haven't, you're a fucking psychopath and you're probably a serial killer.
Speaker A:So, I mean, this is really pulling in on some human emotion of.
Speaker A:I have this task.
Speaker A:It's been put for me.
Speaker B:Someone believes I can do it, but I don't think I can do it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I think, you know any, you know, this is imposter syndrome at its finest, to parlay that into modern terms.
Speaker A:But it also is a lot to ask of one person, like, to stop the apocalypse.
Speaker B:Yay.
Speaker B:But you're the only one that can do it.
Speaker B:Good luck to you.
Speaker A:Figure it out how you weren't sure that you started it.
Speaker A:You just learned this, but now you just need to stop it.
Speaker A:Cool.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:No biggie.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker A:We're going to go over it like.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:And your brother.
Speaker A:Your brother is doing some weird shit.
Speaker B:Your brother is drinking demon blood and.
Speaker B:And killing people with his brain.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I think there, and I alluded to this in the last episode, but I think Sam's dream, like, I get an.
Speaker A:Honestly, I know where it's going.
Speaker A:I know where the season goes and where the series goes.
Speaker A:But the incongruity of Sam developing these demon powers, I'm not sure I like how that's being played against the arc of Dean not thinking he's strong enough.
Speaker A:Like, I almost rather have.
Speaker A:I want Sam to be their supporting Dean.
Speaker A:I don't want sand to be.
Speaker A:He's not strong enough.
Speaker A:And basically piling onto this.
Speaker B:Yeah, well.
Speaker B:And I think that it's an interesting though kind of a switch in some ways because if you go back to the earlier in the series, you know, obviously we're only in season four, but like, it was the perception was when, you know, when Sam started going out, going out with Dean again, that Sam was the weaker of the two when it came to, like, general fighting.
Speaker B:Not that Sam couldn't, but that Dean was the stronger one.
Speaker B:That Dean would always be able to handle things emotionally, where Sam would get more emotionally impacted.
Speaker B:Affected by things.
Speaker B:So it's Kind of a switch, and that's interesting, but I don't.
Speaker B:I get what you're saying.
Speaker B:I don't necessarily like it either, but it is kind of a little bit of a transition from one to the other.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I guess it's also a typical.
Speaker A:I mean, older sibling, younger sibling thing, too, where.
Speaker A:And you're the older sibling and I'm the younger sibling.
Speaker A:So I think that's kind of funny because we both have, like, different perspectives on this.
Speaker A:Him, but that you can really see this.
Speaker A:This kind of switch in the roles that they're playing within their familiar relationship, even though there isn't, like, a dad there.
Speaker A:But, like, Sam is trying to become the bigger brother to basically make up for the fact that his big brother can't handle it, but is also overcompensating because he's a little brother and he should just learn his place.
Speaker A:No, but.
Speaker B:Well, but also he.
Speaker B:He also had to do it on his own for a while because for four months in on Earth time, he was operating under the impression that Dean was dead.
Speaker B:And so he started operating under that premise, which is, I mean, all you could be expected to do.
Speaker B:But.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So we're only at episode 16 of the season.
Speaker A:We go to 22.
Speaker A:So we've got much time to the climax of this.
Speaker B:This five more episodes.
Speaker A:Anything else to say on this?
Speaker A:I think casting is going to be the same because it was.
Speaker A:These are all known players, unless you.
Speaker B:Had anything that was all known players.
Speaker B:I think it was an interesting and emotional episode, though.
Speaker B:It was definitely, like, not the sunshiny thing I was.
Speaker B:Would have, like, been like, oh, it's beautiful.
Speaker B:Sunshine outside.
Speaker B:I'm gonna go lay in the pool in a little bit, but let me watch this really fucking dark, depressing episode first.
Speaker B:But it was good.
Speaker B:Don't get me wrong.
Speaker B:I think that's important to the story arc.
Speaker B:Obviously, it was just a funny contrast.
Speaker A:I will say, I think you'll like next week's episode, although it will probably scare you.
Speaker B:God damn it.
Speaker A:But you'll like it.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:I'll be scared.
Speaker A:I'm really getting obsessed with my wine teeth right now, so this is a problem.
Speaker A:You record on Zoom.
Speaker A:All I can focus on is, like, my wine lip and my wine teeth.
Speaker A:So there should be a filter for this so I can't see this.
Speaker B:All right, well, cheers, Chuck.
Speaker B:Cheers.
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Speaker A:Meow Intro Music arrangement and performance by Dave Cox Piano arrangement and performance by Bob Orozco Meow.
